Senior pics for Wynonna tomorrow..

That's unless of course it isn't raining, and it seems that's all it's been doing lately. She's driving me batty. She turned 18 and now she thinks that means she can do whatever she wants including having no consideration for anyone in this house. Everything is about her boyfriend and his family (they leave much to be desired). She's been treating this house as a pit stop, and taking advantage of everyone. Grr, if she didn't have one more year left of school, I might give her some tough love. It seems like everyone else gets the best parts of her lately. She's all smiles, laughter, and lending a helping hand to her boyfriend and his family while stepping on our back to do it. Then when she graces us with her prescence, she's all crabby and sick and camping out in her room in front of the TV. In the last two weeks she has spent one night home. I realize, yes, she is 18. But if you are adult enough to do whatever you want, then why should mommy do your laundry, and give you a few bucks to pick up whatever it is you need, and take care of your hamster Mr Licky? And then should you have the nerve on the only night you have been home in two weeks to say, you better have saved me some dinner? If I make it through this year without losing all my hair ( I am seriously thinning with the stress) I will be amazed. It's so easy to have the answers to say what you "think" you would do when your kids gets to that stage. I would have thought so a few years ago, but let me tell you...I have been through a lot of stuff in my life, but raising a teen daughter has been the hardest of them all. Anyhoo, if we cancel due to rain tomorrow then next Sun is the reschedule date

Cut off the laundrry service, close the ATM, and set the Hampster free, and make her cook her own damn food. I have BTDT, hell, my kids graduated from HS without a door on her room because she pissed me off.
Good luck with the pics.

Sounds like she's figured out how to do the evil teen routine very well at home while putting on her pretty face in public. I think there's hope for her yet. I do think I'd sell the rodent, though. Or make him free to a good home. Some kid would get a kick out of having him if he doesn't fit in her schedule anymore,

I hear you on the thinning hair. At the moment it's not bad, but good lord, that is a scary thing to go through. You worry all day and then have nightmares about losing all your hair at night.

Start by not bothering with her laundry. Zaven and Caly are younger and do their own laundry 75% of the time. Zaven once asked if there was any way to get clean shorts for tomorrow because he was about out. I told him, "Yes. There's this big white box thing in the kitchen. If you put your shorts in that with all the rest of your clothes, then come back in an hour and move them to the matching box with the door on the front..."

But start small. One or two changes. You won't feel like you're being unreasonable that way. If she's not ever home, leave her a message on her cell or even slip it under her door. It doesn't have to be an ultimatum. Just say that you realize that you haven't been treating her as an adult and you want to show her respect for her new status and stop babying her. So you've decided to step back a bit and let her have her own responsibilities and make some of her own decisions. Then when she notices that her clothes don't magically clean themselves you can say, "Well you're an adult now and want more independence. I'm trying to learn not to baby you."

My hair has thinned really badly in the last 2 years. To the point of being able to see some scalp on the front top area. I am thinking about getting some hair dye in a lighter color than I normally use for two reasons.
1. With darker hair, the scalp stands out like a sore thumb, with lighter hair it won't stand out as bad.
2. The more grey my hair gets, the easier it will be to hide those greys in lighter hair.

I haven't dyed my hair in a while, but the greys stand right out against my medium auburn-brown hair. My hair used to be blond, from childhood all the way through up until after highschool and then it started to darken. Maybe if I do a light auburn? I'm not sure. That is if I have any hair left after the next year or two.

Kathie just called me BTW, they did decide to cancel pics for today, which is just as well because Wynonna hasn't made it home from her BFs yet. It's a good thing pics weren't today because she would not have had time to prepare at all.


Its funny though, her BF who is supposed to adore her, can't make sure that she makes it home in time for one of the most important things to happen in her teen years and I know he'll be expecting to get pictures too. I have half the mind to tell him that if he wants any that he can take her to get some pictures of his own.

It's official, I am considering taking up drinking as a hobby. This is the second night she has been home in about 2 weeks and I swear my blood pressure is about ready to pop the cuff. I sat and talked to her about 10 minutes after she got home and then she went to lay in her room. I went in and told her that I hadnt seen her in two weeks and that it would be nice if we talked for a little bit, she said that she didn't have much to talk about. However, she has been with her BF and his mom and sis all week and has managed to call them 4 times since she got home at 5 this evening. Apparently she can be there all this time and still have plenty to talk with them about. When she finally bothered to get out of bed to eat dinner, she proceeded to tell me that her and BF went to look at apartments and that he is getting an apartment soon and that she is moving in with him. I begged her to reconsider because if she moves out, she will lose her medical coverage. I am also worried because if she moves out before her last year of school ,I have a strong feeling that she won't finish school. Once reality hits them and they realize that he isn't making enough to pay expenses after the first few months and she has to quit school to work so they can pay rent. Not only that, the place they want to get the apartment isn't in the same town as the highschool she is going to. She assumes that as long as she has a ride to school that it won't matter. I tried to tell her that the only way to do that is to lie to the school so she wouldn't have to pay tuition and I don't know that I am comfortable doing that. She doesn't care though, that would give her an excuse to quit school and blame it on me. I quit because mom wouldn't say I was living home so I could finish my last year out at my school... VENT VENT VENT!! After all of that, she told me to be sure to wake her up since we have to take her to have a small bowel x-ray tomorrow, and some bloodwork, so she wants to be ready, but she instructed me that she doesn't want me to wake her up too early.. I think I must have been very awful in a former life...I know a lot of it is the age, and I am willing to take that in stride, but when it is something that affects medical coverage and school then, yes, I am going to get bent out of shape! Because when the $h!t hits the fan and she cannot get a job because she didn't finish school, or she is sick and has to get treatment and is in debt up to her eyeballs who will she turn to, and where will she go? Us, that's where..and it may sound selfish, but I dont' want to be in hock up to my eyeballs because she decided she wanted to play house..

Im afraid Im of the mindset.. "If you believe you are an adult and don't want to live by my rules, then move out, get your own place and be an adult"

Otherwise it's MY rules.. regardless of your age and whether or not you are in school or not...

The thing is, that's what she plans to do is move out with her BF and get their own apartment. But again, my worry is not about her moving out, it is what will happen when she moves out (losing medical, possibly not finishing school, getting pregnant). If those things weren't an issue, especially with the way she has been treating us lately, I do love her dearly but I would be the first at this point to say, "Can I help you pack?"

Oh hell no.

I do not take orders on exactly when to wake up an adult. If they can't tell time and get themselves up when they need to get up in the morning they are screwed the rest of their life. You should have told her that Little Miss All Grown Up can get her own ass out of bed, fix her own breakfast, and meet you in the car at 0800 hours.

Connie wrote:Im afraid Im of the mindset.. "If you believe you are an adult and don't want to live by my rules, then move out, get your own place and be an adult"

Otherwise it's MY rules.. regardless of your age and whether or not you are in school or not...

I agree, want to wake up, get an alarm clock,

I would think she would be grateful for what you have given her already. I have a brother that is just like that, and he (and his wife and three kids) has moved back in with my mom. He demands everything, and of coarse he is the baby so he gets it. Makes me so mad I could scream. Not that he gets what he wants, it's that he is so ungrateful for what he has been given. He doesn't care if my mom has money or not, he takes a check and writes it.

Kelly, I don't know if you are just wanting to vent (which is fine) or are asking for advice. But if you want advice, here is mine:

You CAN NOT help her by allowing her to treat you like shit. You are essentially telling her that abusive relationships are no big deal. She is at more risk from being in an unhealthy relationship than she is from the debt she might incurr by losing her healthcare coverage. I know you probably haven't thought of your relationship with her as abusive. It is. She's abusing you. If she were your husband, would you leave her? If she were the parent and you were the teen, wouldn't someone probably report her to CPS? This is a very, very unhealthy thing for her to be a part of. She needs counseling, but she probably wouldn't agree to go if you brought it up. So it is up to you to let her know that abuse is not ever acceptable. And the only way you can do that is to not let her abuse you. Give her a list of your rules and expectations and let her know that you love her and that any time she's willing to follow those rules, you are willing to do what it takes to help her make a better life for herself. But the minute she breaks a rule all help ends until she can demonstrate that she's willing to change. NOT until she demonstrates she needs your help. It's not the same thing. At the rate she's going she'll always need your help. She needs to deomonstrate that she can treat you with respect. That will be far more help to her than money or education or opportunities or insurance.

Karen, I don't know whether I am asking advice or just venting or both. Truth be told, I know what I should do, I should tell her that in my house, it's my way or the highway, but if I do so and she ends up quitting school to work to try to support her BF and herself, then I might feel like I had some small part in the reason why she quit.
Today she had to get a small bowel x-ray done and some bloodwork. When we got to the hospital, she knew where the lab is because she's had so much bloodwork done in the past, but she never had to take care of the paperwork before hand and register, so I told her, "You're an adult now, you have to do it for yourself and you get to be responsible for the paperwork and stuff." It took some bumbling around on her part and she did get it figured out, though she wasn't happy. Then we went to x-ray and she again looked at me and I told her once again, she needed to handle her own stuff. So she went up to the window and told the lady who she was and that she had an x-ray scheduled for 9am. The lady asked her what the x-ray was for and she calls to me across the waiting room, "Mom, what am I having done?" I went up to the window and told her in front of the lady that since she felt she was adult enough to move out and do what she wants then she should know what's going on with her body..the lady laughed and Wynonna gave me a dirty look. (I am assuming that lady must have kids lol) and then I proceeded to tell her that it was a small bowel x-ray. So they call her in to get changed and I told her that since her x-ray was going to take 2 hours that I was leaving and if she was done by the time I came back that she would have to wait for me. She wasn't happy about that either..

The hard part about the whole thing is the school issue and her health..as far as the attitude and stepping all over everyone, I could tell her to smarten up or fly really fast.. and ultimately I do know that if she decides to quit school that it isn't my fault if I don't do exactly what she wants..but hindsight will kill you, you know? I would always wonder, "gee, if I held off a little and not pushed her, would she have not tried so hard to push back?"

Kelly, I am so proud of you for taking those first steps. I know that it's hard for you and I do sympathize. I just also know that more women are hurt at the hands of boyfriends and husbands than from any other cause.

85-95% of all domestic violence victims are female.
Over 500,000 women are stalked by an intimate partner each year.
5.3 million women are abused each year.
1,232 women are killed each year by an intimate partner.
Domestic violence is the leading cause of injury to women.
Women are more likely to be attacked by someone they know rather than by a stranger.

Consider also the example that is being set for her younger brother. Every day he's learning that it's no big deal to treat a woman without any respect or consideration. And yes, I know that she is not violent to you. But she's everything but violent. If her boyfriend treated her the way she treats you, you'd be scared to death for her. By insisting that she respects your time, your effort, your money, and most of all YOU, you may be saving her life.

I understand if you are venting. I do it all the time.

If you want to know how we feel, and get some advice, I think the 5 ladies up there are ALL spot on. No, I dont have a teenager. BUT, I WAS a teenager, one who had a mother who acted JUST like your daughter. When you are 16, come home to get ready for a date, and the lights are off, but your mom and her friends are sitting there getting drunk because as they put it "well hell, what else could we do?" you kinda have a differnt outlook. OR you would get grounded for NOTHING, ( and I swear it was NOTHING) so she could take your car away, because she didnt have one. (mine was bought and paid for and in MY name. I paid the insurance and I worked full time).

As a 16 year old, I was fed up. She didnt work, she didnt pay bills, she was nothing but a party girl. I never knew when she would be home, or who all she was bringing home. The entire bar that wasnt through partying? someone who had been having a 'rough time' since they got out of the joint? her new best friend who is fighting with her husband?

SO, I walked OUT. I left her with NO lights, no FOOD, NO cable, and NOTHING to hock. I took MY car, MY money, and MY sanity, and I walked OUT> Did I fiqure she would end up drunk and dead because I couldnt go and get her at 2 am when she and her great new buddies had a fight? or she got thrown in jail? Or her husband beat the hell out of her again. ? yep. But, I had to go. It was the best thing I have ever done.

SHe didnt grow up for about 10 more years, and isnt fully 'grown' but she is better.

Will I hesitate to tell my daughter or even my sons that in my home there is a curfew? there are rules? and there are concequences? NOPE. because I dont care if you are 18, unless you are paying rent, you are NOT a boarder, you are under my care, my responsibility and my rules.

THat being said, my 10, 9 and 5 year olds, do their OWN laundry. I'd say 80% of it. can fix themselves a sandwich or raman noodles, and have daily chores. They go out to the hog pen on their own, feed and water them, rain or shine, They feed and water the chickens, gather the eggs, they feed and water horses. The rule is actually, if the pigs and chickens dont get fed, they dont eat. and I am VERY adminent about that. I have thrown their breakfast out the door because they failed to feed the hogs first. It was more than just that, I was lied to. - I know it sounds mean, but if you allow a child, any child to get it over on you they will. Its what they study on doing. I dont make my kids work 12 hours a day, but I do expect help. They understand that, and they fight me, they still try to get one over on me, they are the biggest brats you have ever seen, but they do help me. Not with out a fight. dont ever think that. But if I get 45 minutes out of them through out the day, I am happy, that leaves them all day to play.

heck, just today one of them hid clean clothes under his bed. they were folded, and everything. He was just too lazy to put them in the drawer. he walked PAST the drawer to hide them.

I wont scream, I wont yell. (usually I do) instead- I am going to find some vineger, and pour it on them. They will stink so badly that he wont be able to wear them. But, I was nice and did thier laundry, they decided to treat me like crap. He can rewash them, or smell like crap.

I hate that you are in this position, but honestly, she wont get any better. at all. You are going to go stark raving mad. I know that you want her to stay in school, but, will it happen? she wont come home now, will she come home to go to school? seriously? will she stay all day or skip?

And I will also tell you this, my husband graduated in the top 20%. has some college, was a SGT at the Prison, has ENGENEERED pipelines, (and you have to have some pretty good sense to do that), and he makes the SAME amount of money as my Brother in Law who got a GED and quit high school in the 10th grade. and my other BIL who got a diploma.
along with another BIL who was an MP in the army. They all make the same thing. do the same thing, and are treated the same.


and I know this is long, but one more thing. your own sanity, for the sake of your son and husband, is the most important thing.

Try to look at it backwards.. Really.. So YOU help her save her health insurance, YOU help her get up in the morning, YOU help her do everything she needs to do AND let her treat you like crap..

Where does that leave her two years from now? She will feel like she is ENTITLED to have everything you have already given her.

Trust me on this.. I tried to save my daughter, including kidnapping her and risking imprisonment. Truly.. Now 3 years later she is planning on moving to NY of all places with her 5 month old baby and her bf of two months (who by the way isn't divorced yet, has a baby and another one on the way with another woman)..

"saving" them.. DOES NOT help.. in most instances. The point is, you aren't going to be able to save her for more than one more year so go ahead and let her fall on face now BEFORE she has a baby to take down with her. Yes, she might get pregnant, yes she might not finish school.. But yes you might also just be prolonging the inevitable..OR you might be able to prevent worse things from happening.. It's a gamble either way for sure.

I know you're all right, it just doesn't make it hurt less you know, she is a good kid, she is just very naive.
She is caught up in this relationship with this guy and she will do everything to keep it going. Him and his mother are feeding the situation by telling her that they will make out fine on their own and that I am just trying to break them up and that I don't want her to grow up. There is no structure in her BFs household, so they are telling her that I am too strict and am unreasonable.
I remember being immature at that age, but I also became pregnant about 4 months after I turned 18 and after that I grew up really fast. You're right in saying that she will find a reason to do what she wants to do regardless of what I may do. I agree with everyone that I am not doing any favors to myself or her by letting her act the way she has been to everyone. I know there will come a time when she will realize that he isn't devoted to her and that their relationship is mostly one sided, I wanted to prevent her from the hurt of that. I dealt with the painful realization that the kids father didn't ever love me and I remember how awful that was, how badly it hurt. So yes I made the same mistake relationship wise by picking the same type of guy then as she is now. However, I already had my education and I didn't have medical issues. She also has issues to do with the abuse she suffered at the hands of her real father, she always subconciously felt that there was something wrong with her that he didn't love her enough to not want to abuse her. This relationship with her BF isn't healthy because it is blatantly obvious by the way they act that she is clearly the one putting the most of herself out there for their relationship and I am worried that when something happens that she will blame herself because she wasn't what he needed her to be for him to stay with her.
I know I will have to tell her that I will not help her in anyway to do things that allow her to take advantage of anyone, treat anyone like crap, and/or help her to do anything that puts her in a bad situation. I will not contribute to her moving out, or support anything that I feel is helping her continue to make bad decisions. I will not pay her bills, because after all if she is old enough to make her own decisions then she is old enough to pay her own bills (we couldn't afford to pay them anyway) But I might help her with something small, if it is a good decision that benefits her in a positive way. Such as purchasing school supplies, (no cash though). That is all I can think of to do, it's going to be hard to watch her make choices that will set her back, and make life really hard for her, and hurt her deeply, but she WILL do them regardless

You are making the right choice. And I'm really, really proud of you. Just keep remembering, "I know I will have to tell her that I will not ... help her to do anything that puts her in a bad situation." Those are your words, speaking with great love for your daughter. The lesson she learns from you, the lesson that respect is an integral part of love... that is what will keep her out of the most dangerous situation that any woman can be in.

As parents, we want to protect our kids from pain. But picking up a baby and carrying them everywhere so that they never fall down, that doesn't just break our backs. It also keeps them from ever learning to walk or run. Protecting Kelly from falling down isn't your job at this point in her life. Being there to comfort her when she falls and gets hurt and telling her that she can get up and try again -- that's your job now.

You've already started on the right track by having her fill out her own paperwork. Just continue what you're doing. Every time you have the option of saving her now or of giving her the skills to save herself later, then step back and let her learn to walk, even if it means she falls down.